UJHL??

[Rusty]

Without triggering the world's largest bashfest,
Can anyone shed some light on this league??

[sparkman17]

Never heard of it!

[fangers]

It appears to be associated with folks involved with some AEHL team(s), whose credibility has been questioned by some on various forums.

As with ANY new league/team, players & parents should ask lots of questions and really do your homework before making any committments. That is especially true for non USA Hockey sanctioned leagues because there is no governing body, no one to be accountable to.

[bigcoach]

In trying to keep improving on the product, the "good guy" teams from the AEHL have decided to go out on their own, and have created the UJHL. Being from Canada, several years ago, I have never understood the animousity toward Independant Leagues in the USA! ALL teams must be scrutinized by their "customers" first and foremost. In Canada, there are dozens of leagues that do not look to Hockey Canada to keep a "Big Brother" eye on them. They form a league, usually regionally, play a full season, have a playoff, and crown a champ....that's it. Other than insurance, what the heck does USA Hockey sanctioning get you? Have you ever tried to get them to help out with a dispute ( like tampering)? They turtle faster than the speed of light. When ALL the teams in your league fall under USA Hockey, then you are ALL customers. USAH will do anything to not piss off anyone.....so you get the old " settle this yourselves". Where does the money grab comments come in......take a look at what the Junior "C" teams are charging this season, then look at what the proposed UJHL or the old AEHL was charging. My kid rode on a first class bus...can the same be said for ALL USA Hockey sanctioned teams? He also got contacted by 4 schools after playing in the AEHL....where is the down side??

[fangers]

bigcoach -

Again, how did I bash anyone or anything? Is anything I posted not factual?

I adivsed that players/parents need to really do their homework as the should for ANY league - do you consider that not sound advice?

And independent leagues do not have any governing body to be accountable to. True? And yes, USA Hockey has many issues in it's own right, but at least there is a governing body to set the rules, not simply the league.

[bigcoach]

Fangers....You are correct. You did NOT bash anyone or anything, if fact your advice is good for all parents. Maybe I am the odd man out here, but my kid had a great experience and the AEHL, for the faults that it had also, ran great for the entire season. Once play begins, you never have to remind yourself though that the league is " non-sanctioned", because everyone around hockey will not let you forget!!! If you made it to Nationals this year, you saw first hand the FARCE that USA Hockey can be ( of course this is another topic for another time) Not every business is run smooth, all the time, but from personal experience I would like to see the new league get a shot. Did we need another league....Ah NO! But if a community wants Junior hockey and a town 50 miles away says ...NO you can't play with us, then what choice do they have? :-)

[fangers]

bigcoach said:

Fangers....You are correct. You did NOT bash anyone or anything, if fact your advice is good for all parents. Maybe I am the odd man out here, but my kid had a great experience and the AEHL, for the faults that it had also, ran great for the entire season. Once play begins, you never have to remind yourself though that the league is " non-sanctioned", because everyone around hockey will not let you forget!!! If you made it to Nationals this year, you saw first hand the FARCE that USA Hockey can be ( of course this is another topic for another time) Not every business is run smooth, all the time, but from personal experience I would like to see the new league get a shot. Did we need another league....Ah NO! But if a community wants Junior hockey and a town 50 miles away says ...NO you can't play with us, then what choice do they have? :-)

Glad your son had a good experience.

I come at this whole thing as a dad whose son will be playing juniors next season (had option this year, but opted to play midget major) and who is looking to learn all I can about the various leagues/teams so that - if we have a choice - we can make an informed decision. In my 2+ years of research, overwhelmingly, horror stories far outnumber the good as it realtes to independent leagues. Of course I understand that those who are upset are more apt to broadcast that fact.

[bigcoach]

Look at another fact, that may or may not affect everyone ( for some people funds are not an issue....for others it means alot) I am hearing that some Tier 3 leagues have increased their fees for Junior this season by as much as 30%. The CHA Junior Premier ( looks like "B" ) is being reported as charging as much as $7000 plus! The UJHL team I have been talking to is fixed at $5700 for the season. Like I said before, my son rode in first class coaches last season and was very comfortable at the Hampton or Doubletree. You also have to look at the management structure of the league you are looking at ( just as you would for an idependent league ) Is it two guys running a league or one guy dictating to it's " board" that things will work this way or not at all! Some of the top leagues, may surprise you when you look deeper into their "higharchy"Posters on this and the Junior Hockey Mag board can fill you in on what I mean, from past experiences!. Good luck and I wish your son well.....like I said, the kids don't care who is running things as long as when they get to the rink, the ice is hard and the benches aren't too small!!! :-) :-)

[iceincarolina]

My son has been contacted by a coach whose team is in the UJHL. I'm just trying to do some research so that my son can play in a competitive, well run league with good ties to colleges. I'm reading mixed reviews of this new league. Any other stories, good or bad, that you can let me know about?

[sparkman17]

As the father of a former NAHL player, I will have to tell you that the chances of your son gaining a Div I college commitment from this league is slim to none....at best. Just look at Chris Heisenberg's blog and you will see that new or obscure leauges place NO ONE. USHL, NAHL, the variety of Canadian leagues, and Prep Schools place the boys. Golden boys from elite MM programs, (like Honeybaked, Belle Tire, etc) also have an outside chance. I hate to sound like a pesimist, however, the facts are the facts. So much of what goes on is totally out of you and your son's hands, anyway. Who is the coach? Does he have connections? Does he "like" your son? Is he a great salesman? So many questions. Then there are things within your scope of control. What are your son's academic goals? Does a Div III school have the curriculum and/or program that would benefit him? What is his GPA? (If you notice, I didn't even ask about his skill level, as that has very little to do with anything!!! Sad but true.) I wish you and your son the best of luck. I hope that he plays for the love of the game, and please realize that gaining a college scholorship is just icing on the cake!!!

[bigcoach]

Sparkman.....WHAT?? Put the player on the ice, and they will come! What if the boy is not NAHL or USHL caliber, but is still a nice player? What if all his academics are in line? You are right to ask about the coach...it is the coach that will get the player seen by the right people, no matter what league they are in!!! Am I to read that your son played in the NAHL and did NOT get a college commitement? To say they place no one is a little far reaching....NO? I can name you four kids that my son played with in the AEHL that are going to good schools this year. If you were at USA Hockey Nationals this year, you can't really say that the mess we all were there to view is the end all of recruiting? Games for kids at 7:30 am! That attracts alot of scouts and recruiters.,....yeah right! I, for one, am tired of people that have never been involved with anything outside of USA Hockey taking shots at other venues for the sport.....I guess the brainwashing is in it's advanced stages. Ask anyone from a Canadian league how they do with setting up their own leagues and playing a season and having a championship. From province to province WITHOUT the allmighty big brother collecting fees... to do what? Take a look for a moment at the past chairs of Junior Council.....do you think that there are agendas involved? Do you think that just maybe they take care of their friends in leagues they have been associated with in the past? I did not like the "slim to none" comment....give me facts you base this on.

[sparkman17]

Gee, Bigcoach, you proved my point exactly!!!
C'mon....you said it yourself...4 kids!!!!!!!!!!! That is it?? For a WHOLE league?? That is a total waste of time and, since they are playing Tier III...BIG MONEY!!!!!!
And what schools are they? Some little Div III school that only offers a liberal arts degree? Again, a total waste of time. Although I admit that the vast majority of boys playing in the big schools take "underwater basket weaving". But with a degree in liberal arts, you can work at a Burger King.

[sparkman17]

Oh, and I just looked through all of the updated list of college committments, but not a single boy from the AEHL. PLEASE don't tell me you consider club hockey, (ACHA), playing college hockey???!!! That is like playing drop-in....except much more expensive.

[bigcoach]

So....Sparky....what school did your son play his way into? From the NAHL to where? I coached a kid in youth, years ago, that is graduating with a degree from Robert Morris, where he played CLUB hockey. Yes....lowly CLUB hockey. Played in Bentonville rink in Chicago, if front of 600 to 1000 home fans.....said he had a great time....but then you would know best. I am guessing he just wasted his time in such a low life institution. Last I heard he skipped right over Burger King and is going into Investment and Securities, for a firm in Chicago. I guess McDonald's wasn't hiring either! When you even trash DIII hockey and schools, you must be thrilled your kid got a full ride at a DI school! Where is he going?

[bigcoach]

Seriously though.... this may help " iceincarolina" with a good question he had. Enough with the good natured fun with Sparky!! lol ( transferred from another thread"

Parents and Players,

First let me introduce myself my name is Dennis Canfield Director of Hockey Operations and Head Coach of the Jamestown Jets. We will begin play this fall in the newly formed UJHL a tier III type Jr A league. For those wondering we will be applying for sanctioning this June in Colorado with USA and have an elected official to represent our league and regardless we will have insurance for all players.

My goal here is to inform parents through the proper channels about our team and league. I welcome everyone interested in learning more about the Jets to contact me directly if any questions should arise good or bad.

In starting something new there will always be negativity and if you cannot understand that then you are in the wrong field. We fully understand that this is the case and regardless we are committed to being here long term and building a first class organization and it starts right now. The city of Jamestown is very excited to bring junior hockey to the southern tier and so are we and we chose to promote hockey not negatively hurt it. The Jamestown Savings Bank Arena is one of the best Arenas in the region and has a wonderful staff committed to making this a community asset. Our goal is to promote our players, our program, and the city of Jamestown.

Jamestown is a great place for hockey our facility is gorgeous and seats 2,400 fans for hockey and the arena has just approved and been awarded money for an expansion project. Additionally our team has an office on the main level, workout room and a locker room complete with stalls and storage area. We've brought on a full time equipment manager and we are in the process of hiring an announcer as all of our games will be broadcast via the web for fans and parents.

The UJHL was formed by Barry Soskin and other owners who are bringing in teams from other leagues or starting expansion teams. Barry and I own Jamestown below is an article which explains who Barry is.
www.albertleatribune.com/articles/2008/03/25/news/news3.txt As of April 30th the Albert Lea Thunder was announced which my partner owns and will begin play this fall in the NAHL. I am working currently for the team as a scout as they prepare for the May 20th draft.

Back to the Jets we will be hosting our first open camp on may 16-18th and we are seeking players 16-20. for those parents who are wondering about housing we are currently setting up billet families which we will pre screen prior to the season. Our team is committed to community involvement and all of our players will be assigned to a youth program to attend time permitting. Additionally we will provide every player an in house tutor service at the arena which will be available following practice for players studies. We provide hotels and meals on the road and we will travel in track suits for uniformity. On off weekends we will be organizing college visits for players to begin the recruiting process. I've already spoken with several colleges about this including Fredonia State and several Buffalo colleges. Additionally we have spoken with the Jamestown High School principle who supports us and is willing to personally speak with any parents regarding the school district.

I've known Mr. Soskin for many years having played for him with the Toledo Storm. He formed the Toledo Storm and they never missed the playoffs in his tenure, won 5 division titles, 2 regular season titles, and the Kelly Cup Championship twice. The Toledo Storm once featured a female goaltender, Erin Whitten, who on March 7, 1996 became the first woman ever to appear in a professional hockey game in a position other than goaltender; she played at forward for 18 seconds in a game against the Madison Monsters. She was also the first U.S.-born woman to play professional hockey when she appeared for the East Coast Hockey League's Toledo Storm, and on October 30, 1993, became the first woman goaltender to record a professional victory.

I am excited about the upcoming season and the opportunity to develope players and feel we offer a great channel towards the next step. I look forward to hearing from you all.

For more information on the Jets please visit our website www.JamestownJets.com email me direct @ [e-mail] or call the Jets hockey office @ 716-484-2624 ext 217

Jets Open Camp May 16-18th @ JSBIA cost is $150


Link to Post - Back to Top IP: Logged
Regards,
Dennis Canfield
Jamestown Jets Jr Hockey
Director of Hockey Operations & Head Coach
716-484-2624 Ext 217
[e-mail]
Albert Lea Thunder NAHL Scout

[sparkman17]

BC...you have a great sense of humor!!!! (Although you must have never been on a debate team, because you never answer ANY questions posed!)
By the way, he is at a major university finishing his degree in pharmacy...thought you should know!!!

[bigcoach]

Oh crap... At my age it isn't that I don't want to answer....I always forget the question!! I also took quite a few shots to the mellon in my playing days ( helmets were optional!! ) Let me know when your boy gets that degree....I can ALWAYS use a good pharmacist!....is he still playing hockey?

[crosscheck]

Unless this league gets sanctioned, I would be wary. Most of these types of leagues come and go like the wind blows. Usually with fists full of players money who are left with no where to play. How many of these types of leagues have popped up, then vanished in the past 5 years? I can think of about 8 right off the top of my head. All have one thing in common, they take your money and you have no recourse after they do that. For those looking for a true hockey experience, go in the legit sanctioned leagues. If your son isn't good enough to make those, it should be a sign to get him on with things besides hockey.

[bigcoach]

Oh boy...another "expert"...and what was your inner dealings with the AEHL ( that seems to be the league flavour of the month ), that makes you an overall guru about this subject....or was there just room on the bandwagon, so you figured you would jump on. My kid played....did yours? Did you coach or manage in one of "those" leagues? How much money did you lose?

[bigcoach]

Whoa...wait ...I should have read C.C's posting more carefully! NOW I know what USA Hockey does for you...if a team or league folds mid-season or after a few weeks of play, USA Hockey will get your money back for you!! Now I see.....so is that why the parents of kids that signed and payed to play for the Albany RiverRats team in the CHA two seasons ago had to obtain their own legal council? Let me ask you C.C....do you think they got their money back? Let me tell you first hand the answer to that one......think about what you are writing.

[crosscheck]

May 16, 2008 14:18:51 GMT -5 bigcoach said:

Whoa...wait ...I should have read C.C's posting more carefully! NOW I know what USA Hockey does for you...if a team or league folds mid-season or after a few weeks of play, USA Hockey will get your money back for you!! Now I see.....so is that why the parents of kids that signed and payed to play for the Albany RiverRats team in the CHA two seasons ago had to obtain their own legal council? Let me ask you C.C....do you think they got their money back? Let me tell you first hand the answer to that one......think about what you are writing.

You cite one example of a CHA league that at the time was not sanctioned above Jr. C. I can site dozens of others who have taken the money and run. If you wish, I can provide a list. Its a long list. The fact is many prey on the uninformed and make a quick buck. I think this league has no record of anything so one would be taking a monumental risk to play there. Silly option when you look at legit leagues who have history of providing a good product.

[bigcoach]

A CHA league??? Am I missing something?? So I am to assume then that ALL independent operators are crooks? What happens when a good hockey town, that runs a great youth program, wants to move into Junior, BUT because of mileage restrictions, ( they are too close to an established league team...75 to 100 miles ) they cannot field a team.....should they just forget it? What about the kids that do not want to leave home....before we get any further...how about quoting from my first reply and answer THOSE questions!

[crosscheck]

Dennis, lets start with the fact that we now find out your league hasn't even approached USA Hockey. But you insist that you are going to be Tier III Jr. A. Apparently that isn't an honest statement Dennis. That is why these types of leagues have such a bad history. Individuals making claims that simply aren't true. And they get some of the uneducated to fall for it.

As far as trying to create new teams in an area, why are you trying to do that? Usually its because of a chance for financial gain or someone's son didn't make the local team. Same story, different faces and names, but same ole story. I don't lump every group/team into the same bag, but from what I hear from this group, the early returns are not favorable.

[bigcoach]

The fact that the league has not yet FILED the paperwork is not that the truth was not told. The league reps were o.k'd to appear at the Annual meetings in Colorado by Mr. Boxer. A misunderstanding occured, in a conference call, that papers were to be filed. They have not been filed as of today. It is my undeerstanding that will be taken care of a.s.a.p...
Why are you trying to create a team? Are you kidding me? If youth organizations have players ready to move on, age wise as well as skill wise, why would you not want a team in your town? The nearest Junior team is 50 miles away...get your head out of the dark ages were you think everyone is trying rip everyone else off! You have yet to answer the question of how you are such an expert at being ripped off by a league....once you come forth with answers, people will begin to take you seriously!! Where are you getting your information to base your "early returns" on? Begin to answer what has been asked.....we will proceed from there!

[crosscheck]

May 19, 2008 16:18:44 GMT -5 bigcoach said:

The fact that the league has not yet FILED the paperwork is not that the truth was not told. The league reps were o.k'd to appear at the Annual meetings in Colorado by Mr. Boxer. A misunderstanding occured, in a conference call, that papers were to be filed. They have not been filed as of today. It is my undeerstanding that will be taken care of a.s.a.p...
Why are you trying to create a team? Are you kidding me? If youth organizations have players ready to move on, age wise as well as skill wise, why would you not want a team in your town? The nearest Junior team is 50 miles away...get your head out of the dark ages were you think everyone is trying rip everyone else off! You have yet to answer the question of how you are such an expert at being ripped off by a league....once you come forth with answers, people will begin to take you seriously!! Where are you getting your information to base your "early returns" on? Begin to answer what has been asked.....we will proceed from there!

According to USA Hockey in an official letter sent to all it's members, they state they have never been in contact from anyone from your league. The letter was dated May 16 I believe. I was afforded a copy yesterday. And there in lies your problem (your league's problem) in credibility. You proclaim Tier III Jr. A status but have NEVER even talked to USA Hockey. That is just another example of how these types of leagues do business. If you want the UJHL not to be lumped in with the other Indy leagues of terrible reputation, then they need to start acting different than the rest of the Indy leagues with those types of reputation. Right off the bat, you mislead the players about your status. What was the motivation for that? There is nothing you can twist and turn to avoid that. This league starts off like all the rest of the Indy leagues. With questions of honesty and integrity. Don't be mad at me for being the guy who asked the question weeks ago and for pointing out the misleading information you provided. You guys might be the greatest thing since sliced bread, but you have blown it so far and have definitely thrown up a red flag about your credibility. Believe me, for USA Hockey to write the letter they wrote, someone sounded pissed off about the misleading information to me.

As far as your town needing a Tier III Jr. A team, I don't think that watering down the saturated East with another Junior team/league is the answer. Its all about "my town" with folks like yourself. And as soon as "your son" leaves it goes by the wayside. If your kids are good enough, move them on to a legit program. No reason to water down our Junior system even more because you feel you deserve it. Thats my point, and if you think every town deserves a Junior team, that can be your point. I would like to look at Juniors though as a higher level of hockey not a recreation house level some are striving to make it.

[bigcoach]

XC...Look at it however you want. Were leagues like the CHA not founded on teams in everyone's backyard? When a city or a foundation builds a rink to start from scratch a youth hockey program and then as a natural progression, Junior hockey follows. Where is the problem? There is not an open league within 100 miles. The new Tier 3's are locked in a probation period...so your answer is " tough" Even though a couple of hundred people actually want to watch Junior hockey in THEIR rink, the experts like you would tell them " too bad" Are we not suppose to be helping promote Junior hockey on these boards? Please post part or all of your letter from USA Hockey... I have e-mails... do you? By posting a portion, of the letter you obtained ( and not the one that has been posted on other boards for the last 36 hours ) your credibility may somewhat be restored...well maybe. Keep throwing up other" rumor" threads and that won't last long either!!

[bigcoach]

The actual number total, I was told, was 28....6 goalies...still low, but an early calender tryout, and the team was announced only 10 days or so before the camp... Approx. the same numbers at the other tryouts. Others are scheduled for late in the summer.....

[bigcoach]

D.P...You jumping on the bashwagon also? It sems to be the thing to do these days...hey it's easy! The Delaware team is in deep limbo or not functioning ( is that a loss? )....the website needs a webmaster that will be in place soon. The baggage of the old league was cast aside. Take a close look at the teams that are standing. From Mr Soskin to Mr Baldwin in Ohio, top quality people. Noone expects people to change their opinions overnight....that will never happen. But, as in life, if you try and improve, be it a person or a product, in the least ,give them a chance. If kids get to top schools, then the league will be a success.... if not BASH ON!!

[ajreis]

You are my man Crossy. I have read this long enough. I posted a reply on TJHN and Dad gave me a spankin but for the life of me I have a hard time buying in to ANYTHING that the seller has to work so hard to sell. A good product sells itself.

Look at some of the watered down teams in T-III A already, the last thing that we all need is another league. If a team or teams want to join up why not apply to an existing league for expansion or explore the option of purchasing a team in an existing league?

I won't cast the obvious stone here but the question needs to be answered on why these people cannot approach this through conventional methods. BC, like many others on here I just hate misrepresentation of ANY team or league. If you want in, do it on the up and up and we will all get behind you, just don't promise me steak when the only thing on the menu is hot dogs.

$7,000.00? $5700.00? Do your homework folks, $5,000.00 is the going rate in NorPac, a USAH sanctioned league that has endured the test of time. 3-3-0 at nationals this year and continuing to improve just as the rest of the T-III A leagues are doing. Whether it be the CSHL, MnJHL, or the WSHL the play is improving and I am proud to be a part of it.

BTW- Look at the requirements in the USAH guide for a T-III A team, there are some that still have a ways to go but they are getting there. Nice bus? Nice Hotel? They had better be nice or all of those involved are doing their league a disservice.

Just for you Big Coach, I will out myself.

Josh Reis
GM
Seattle Totems

[bigcoach]

I give you all the credit in the world for identifying yourself. The fact you have to jump boards to get your bashing in tells me you are at least passionate. The fact that you can break even on $5000 is a tribute to your equipment buying, etc. Let it be known, on your dime, that the UJHL has been invited to address the congress and is in the process of getting the owners to file papers, etc by weeks end. Chances are that no new leagues will be sanctioned, but at least the league is trying to do all the right things to obtain sanctioning. I am happy for the success of your league and team....good job. I enjoyed watching your teams play at Nationals, this year, when my team was not playing. Please go back and read the whole thread though...you CANNOT explore expansion if you are currently in probation because of obtaing Tier 3 Junior "A" status ( CSHL) you cannot sell a franchise while in probation ( CSHL ).... Being a successful GM, I would have thought you would have known that.....you must have just forgot, being so busy counting your profits......have a great season!!