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Post by mctopeka on Dec 10, 2007 12:06:58 GMT -5
Has the NAHL lost their minds? Washington? Are these owners or the League going to subsidize the other NAHL teams travel costs to play them like the Alaska teams do? If not there aren't many NAHL teams that can afford these costs. The teams are going to have to fly in and that gets expensive, even if you add it to the Alaska Run. Besides that if you add this into the the Alaska Run it would end up being a month long road trip and that is way to long for these kids to be on the road. I hope the owners of this franchise have deep pockets.
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Post by Rusty on Dec 10, 2007 14:26:23 GMT -5
I was wondering if anyone would catch that in the blog. I had started a response, but never finished it. I need to thank Marc Foster's blog for my humor of the week. It was my sincere desire that the NAHL in it's infinite mediocrity would realize the fool hardiness of putting teams well outside the scope of reasonable travel budgets. The “N” has decided to try to put a team in “Wenatchee”  I cannot see this translates to much more than ego. This group has not had a lot of success at this level as I am told. I cannot really believe they have / are doing ANY due diligence in this whole deal. For any of you who are unaware or might care, Wenatchee is sort of halfway between Seattle / Everett and Spokane. Too bad USAH is so shortsighted as to disallow them to play in the Canadian league. It is a good league, or put that area in the NorPac footprint. There is just no Jr A in the area and puts them in the same fix that Fairbanks was in for so many years. This is the type of move the WHA would make. I sure would hate to see Wenatchee get a bad taste in it’s mouth for Jr Hockey when this group goes bust and runs off leaving a big bill. I hope the city has the good sense to say no. I guess stupid is forever with some people. |
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Post by Marc Foster on Dec 11, 2007 11:19:50 GMT -5
Given the nature of Krupka's departure I'm not sure any of his initiatives were going to be adopted, even posthumously... Just a bit of friendly advice for any would-be bloggers out there. If you want to turn a league conference call upside down, blog something decided on in the meeting before the meeting is over.  Oh, to have been a fly on the wall for that...  Still, my response would have been "what are you doing reading Foster's Blog in the middle of a conference call?! |
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Dad
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Post by Dad on Dec 11, 2007 11:50:49 GMT -5
~~Still, my response would have been "what are you doing reading Foster's Blog in the middle of a conference call?! The obvious retort being... "I see we are BOTH reading it!" ;D I become more convinced daily that the league admins honestly believe: A We are stupid. B They are a cut above average in intelligence C They can make anything hapen if they just wish hard enough, generate enough smoke AND use enough mirrors. (see A)  Foster 4 Commish!!  |
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Post by Marc Foster on Dec 11, 2007 12:48:01 GMT -5
Foster 4 Commish!! How many times have I told you.... NO!!! *swats your nose with a rolled up newspaper* |
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Dad
Squirt
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Post by Dad on Dec 11, 2007 13:14:22 GMT -5
Foster 4 Commish!! How many times have I told you.... NO!!! *swats your nose with a rolled up newspaper*Your lips say no, no, no... But your eyes... ;D |
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Post by vahockey on Dec 11, 2007 14:02:36 GMT -5
I think Krupka's first and only order of business was to get all the owners caught up in their dues. That seemed to have pi$$ed off enough owners that he got launched before he started. He did have the tact to point out that Santa Fe was as good as dead man walking, which also didn't go over very well despite the accuracy.
Little off-topic, but owners tend to like those expansion fees. Wenatchee money spends the same as Midwest money, regardless of whether or not it's a smart move (assuming this is a potential expansion franchise, or a franchise that was turned back into the league).
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moe
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Post by moe on Dec 12, 2007 19:38:26 GMT -5
How many times have I told you.... NO!!! *swats your nose with a rolled up newspaper*Your lips say no, no, no... But your eyes... ;D Okay. That's funny! |
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Post by player on Jan 2, 2008 13:28:38 GMT -5
I wonder if anyone has noticed the name Rocky Flynn in the Wenatchee articles? His son played for Ft Van during there last season as a NORPAC Team.... don't want to start the Ft van bashing but if it smells like a fish....
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Post by sgtrock on Jan 4, 2008 9:50:48 GMT -5
Player, Just because his kid played there How does it make Rocky Flynn guilty of anything? Was Flynn involved with Operations of the team? The answer is no. Was Flynn looking out for his kid while he was there? Yes. Does the fact that I was involved with the team last season make me guilty of anything? No. So people know that Ft Van no longer exists, so what? Stir you bile elsewhere. The Flynn family are stand up folks and if Rocky wants to get involved with hockey good luck and I am glad to see he is.
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Post by player on Jan 4, 2008 12:16:37 GMT -5
dude, dial it back a bit...... what bothers me about the whole wenatchee thing is that is has a bit of desperation to it. The BCHL would have been a much better fit and too bad that one didn't work. Several members of the city council have resisted the idea all along... the plan doesn't feel solid to me and I worry about ruining a market that is so ripe for Jr hockey. In small venue areas a project like this has to be successful or small town people will always say "it won't work, it won't work" No bile intended.... it seems to me that egos might be involved. JUST AN OBSERVATION.....
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Post by tero on Jan 4, 2008 22:20:18 GMT -5
While there is no doubt Flynn's motivation for a junior team is affected by the age of his own kid, he has nothing to do with Ft. Vancouver, and he is the local face guy for Global and other investors. As for Wenatchee getting a NAHL team, USA Hockey has no choice but to support this as they are the reason the BCHL is not going to Wenatchee to begin with. They denied the application for Wenatchee joining the BCHL, and with Wenatchee building a 4700 seat arena for hockey and no team because of USA Hockey they have to get creative and the NAHL is the best option as bad as it may seem. Global and Kozubeck went out and got the NAHL as they need a tenant in a building they will manage. Also the NAHL wants to get more teams out west to reduce the cost of the Alaska teams. There is no option for an USHL team, no BCHL, and the WHL isn't adding a USA based team at this time. So the NAHL it is. There is no other choice.
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Post by player on Jan 10, 2008 2:08:29 GMT -5
Junior hockey — Prospective franchise clears hurdle
By Eric Gordon
and Jay Patrick
World staff writers
Posted January 09, 2008
WENATCHEE — The ownership group trying to bring an amateur hockey franchise to Wenatchee submitted its application for membership to the Texas-based North American Hockey League on Friday, said league Commissioner Mark Frankenfeld.
The formal application, which must show that a Wenatchee team would be financially viable, is a key step in the process to establish a team, said Rocky Flynn of Wenatchee, spokesman for the ownership group.
Lawyers for the 17-team league will now review the application, Frankenfeld said. After that, the league's board of governors could grant conditional approval of the Wenatchee franchise later this month.
Frankenfeld said the franchise still needs to secure a lease to play in the Greater Wenatchee Regional Events Center, scheduled to open in September.
"The next thing we need to do before we can go further and complete the purchase of the team is complete our contract with the arena," Flynn said.
Factors involved, Flynn said, include the cost per night to hold games, the percentage of concessions revenue allocated to the team, and the types of facilities available to the team — such as a team suite, locker room with offices, and a business office.
When asked about the progress of the lease negotiations, Flynn said only that it's still in the works. As for the outcome, he said simply, "We'll see."
On the prospects of franchise approval and the viability of the Wenatchee market, Frankenfeld said, "If they hire the right people and get a lease, they (the ownership group) potentially have a home run coming down the alley."
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Post by mctopeka on Feb 19, 2008 16:21:18 GMT -5
Bump. What do your sources tell you on this one now Marc? They should have voted on it by now.
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Post by Marc Foster on Feb 20, 2008 8:00:21 GMT -5
I heard nothing from nobody yesterday... go figure...
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Post by Marc Foster on Feb 20, 2008 18:12:36 GMT -5
Ummm, there was no vote... it's tomorrow... wenatcheeworld.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080220/NEWS04/800646457My snippy comments are in italics... Outcome of hockey vote unknown By Jay Patrick World staff writer Posted February 20, 2008 WENATCHEE — Who knows if Wenatchee is getting a hockey team? No one... Maybe Rocky Flynn or Mark Frankenfeld, but they're not talking. Don't waste your time, they don't know any more than the rest of us...Flynn is part of the would-be ownership group of a Wenatchee hockey team. He speaks for the group. Frankenfeld is commissioner of the North American Hockey League. The league's board of governors was to vote Monday to approve or deny Flynn's bid to locate an NAHL franchise here. Since Washington is in the Pacific Time Zone, saying something is on Monday there means it's on Thursday for the rest of us...In a prior interview, Frankenfeld characterized the Monday vote as the do-or-die moment for the Wenatchee bid. But you can't say that since the league didn't, the team is dead...Frankenfeld and Flynn could not be reached for news on the outcome of the vote. Messages left on their cell phones Tuesday and this morning have not been returned. For good reason...Linda Haglund, sales manager for the Greater Wenatchee Regional Events Center, said this morning she has not been informed about the outcome of the vote. A hockey team has been billed as an anchor tenant for the arena and needed for the arena's financial success. Cheeseburger, cheeseburger, cheeseburger... no vote, we got Pepsi...For the team to begin play this fall as planned, the franchise would have had to receive approval Monday. Or Thursday, depending on what time zone you are in...The first league tapped to locate here, the British Columbia Hockey League, pulled out in October after encountering resistance from USA Hockey, which objected to a Canadian-owned team operating in the United States. There's lots of Canadians who own USHL and NAHL teams, it's that it was a Canadian LEAGUE that USAH found objectionable... |
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Post by mctopeka on Feb 21, 2008 9:36:35 GMT -5
Marc my sources tell me the Alaska teams are going to help them with travel costs. They will travel over with the Alaska Teams when they come to the lower 48 and the lower 48 teams going to Alaska will add another week to their already long 3 week Alaska Journey to play the Wenatchee team. As always, I'm just saying.
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Post by Marc Foster on Feb 21, 2008 16:14:04 GMT -5
I've received word the franchise has been approved, but have no other details to offer...
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Post by tero on Feb 21, 2008 22:34:49 GMT -5
So the Team is dead huh?
Duh... I guess they were granted a team on Thursday after they delayed the vote on Monday like the Wenatchee World said, but I guess in Texas they don't get the web from the Pacific Time Zone... Duh.. Maybe another cheeseburger and some folks could learn to read!
Wenatchee has apparently won conditional approval for a franchise to play this fall in the North American Hockey League.
Rocky Flynn, a member of the three-person ownership group that would operate the franchise, said Thursday afternoon that he had received word from the league on a vote that took place earlier in the day..
Flynn said he had yet to receive a list of the conditions. But he said he is certain one will be to nail down a lease on the Greater Wenatchee Regional Events Center, now being built near Walla Walla Point Park.
Flynn said he expects to receive the list of conditions from the league by Friday morning.
-- World staff
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Post by Marc Foster on Feb 22, 2008 7:57:27 GMT -5
Wow... it seems someone needs some reading comprehension skills... I'll bet you're teeing off on the following, tero:
But you can't say that since the league didn't, the team is dead...
Now, maybe this will help:
But you can't say that "since the league didn't, the team is dead"...
There... make sense now? I never said Wenatchee was dead. Learn to grasp context before the next time you try to rip into me.
As for the apparently multiple aborted votes. On the 13th I referenced a WenWorld article stating there was to be a vote. The response I got from several teams around the league was "What vote? We're not having a vote. We've been provided only the most basic of information regarding their application, why the hell would we want to vote on it now?" Then we were supposed to have a vote Monday... what happened then? Finally we have a vote and conditional approval on Thursday. Congratulations, now they team just needs to get their lease, division, and travel sorted out. These are, by the way, things that should have been resolved before a vote was ever taken.
This entire expansion process has been an invitation to failure. Do I want it to fail? No. But do I think that a Wenatchee franchise will still be in the NAHL in five years? No. I hope I'm wrong.
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Post by offtheglass on Feb 22, 2008 8:21:26 GMT -5
Marc my sources tell me the Alaska teams are going to help them with travel costs. They will travel over with the Alaska Teams when they come to the lower 48 and the lower 48 teams going to Alaska will add another week to their already long 3 week Alaska Journey to play the Wenatchee team. As always, I'm just saying. mctopeka, You know I am not sure all the Alaska teams will be around next year. That is, are you sure Kenai will still be active? |
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Post by mctopeka on Feb 22, 2008 11:27:29 GMT -5
I think Kenai has enough money behind them to last. The other Alaska teams need the playing partners and will see to it. Last I heard they want the Lower 48 teams to make two 2 week trips to Alaska and Washington instead of one 4 week trip playing two teams each trip. We'll see how it goes.
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Post by mctopeka on Feb 22, 2008 20:24:51 GMT -5
Just a couple of the Wanatchee conditions 1000 season ticket commitments and $200,000 in Corporate sales. WOW, did any other NAHL franchize have to meet those?
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Post by tero on Feb 22, 2008 22:28:23 GMT -5
Marc,
While you might like to think you are neutral on this issue it is clear you have nothing but disdain for the idea of Wenatchee getting a franchise. Your choice to mock the time zone issue and whether the Wenatchee World gets the story is juvenile.
I don't think there is anyone that doesn't get that Wenatchee being in the NAHL is not the ideal result. However there are not many choices in this, USA Hockey has to support Wenatchee getting a team or get sued for restraint of trade by blocking the BCHL coming to Wenatchee. Is the BCHL a better option for Wenatchee of course, but that was denied them. That doesn't mean that somehow Wenatchee is being stupid, they are just trying to find a solution that may or may not work out. There is no one acting out of malice and it sure as heck doesn't deserve your snide attitude. So get off Wenatchee's back and maybe there would be no need to 'rip' you.
Tero
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Post by Marc Foster on Feb 23, 2008 1:52:59 GMT -5
Marc, While you might like to think you are neutral on this issue it is clear you have nothing but disdain for the idea of Wenatchee getting a franchise. Your choice to mock the time zone issue and whether the Wenatchee World gets the story is juvenile. Me, neutral? I'm sorry, you must have me confused with a member of the media. There's some Alaska folks on here, ask them if I make fun of their time zone, and I'm not really making fun of the WenWorld. They're only reporting what they are being told (if/when they get told anything). I'm not the one who bought the magic beans that Global sold. If there are some guys that want to make a go of Wenatchee in the NAHL, fine, but who's responsibility is it to fill those arena dates? Not a potential hockey owner. I think the league did the right thing in requiring the $200k in corp sales and 1,000 season tickets. That only adds up to about 50%-75% of their budget. Oh, and we still don't know where this team is going to be placed, division-wise. But this discussion isn't about Wenatchee, and has never really been... it's about yet another example of process-failure by the NAHL. You can't see that because you're too busy defending Wenatchee's apparent inferiority complex. |
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Post by tero on Feb 23, 2008 11:38:58 GMT -5
Sorry I was mistaken by the board title "Wenatchee?" I thought this WAS about Wenatchee getting a team. Now whether it is Wenatchee's inferiority complex or your derogatory comments that drives the discussion that remains to be seen. Am I defending Wenatchee's decision to build a two sheet hockey facility with seating for 5,000? you bet. Do I support the community trying to get the highest level of hockey available? guilty. Do I think that more rinks, in more areas of the country with more teams is a good idea? Absolutely. Is Wenatchee with 45 years of amateur hockey and over 100 years of hockey history deserving of a team in the only league they can get at this point? Why Not.
Is Alaska and now Wenatchee invading the league some kind of affront to you? It sure isn't because those out West WANT to play in league with Texas. It is because it is all there is right now.
If your animosity to western expansion is based on the NAHL decision making process being messed up, and if by being messed up it results in Wenatchee getting a team, good!!
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Post by crosscheck on Feb 23, 2008 15:12:41 GMT -5
Putting Wenatchee in the NAHL is ridiculous. However, if it becomes a reality, the Divisions should be this: North: USDTP Mahoning Valley Alpena Traverse City Marquette Central: Northern Iowa Bismarck Alexandria Southern Minnesota Fargo South: St. Louis Springfield Topeka Wichita Falls Texas Northwest: Fairbanks Wenatchee Kenai Alaska Of course, we are talking about the NAHL here so who knows what they will do.  |
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Post by hockey on Feb 23, 2008 22:45:12 GMT -5
www.gwreventscenter.com/Its pretty funny that all of their marketing talks about hockey, with no hockey team. www.wenatchee.org/Demographics/QuickFacts.PDF30,000 households with an average of roughly 2.6 persons per household. This means with 1000 season tickets minimum and 2.6 people per house, that's roughly 385 season ticket packages sold. The good news is only 1.8% of the households have to buy season tickets, heh. Just to make the minimum goals. The scary news is the region only makes about 85% as much the rest of the state at around 36k per year.
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Post by mctopeka on Feb 25, 2008 13:14:44 GMT -5
South: St. Louis Springfield Topeka Wichita Falls Texas This would be one tough division. I would love to see this happen. |
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Post by fangers on Feb 25, 2008 13:32:52 GMT -5
Putting Wenatchee in the NAHL is ridiculous. However, if it becomes a reality, the Divisions should be this: North: USDTP Mahoning Valley Alpena Traverse City Marquette Central: Northern Iowa Bismarck Alexandria Southern Minnesota Fargo South: St. Louis Springfield Topeka Wichita Falls Texas Northwest: Fairbanks Wenatchee Kenai Alaska Of course, we are talking about the NAHL here so who knows what they will do. That makes WAY TOO MUCH sense to ever be implemented.... |
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The obvious retort being... "I see we are BOTH reading it!" ;D
